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Jimmy Mnemonic
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Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 10:12 pm |
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Joined: | 22 Aug 2004 |
Posts: | 1349 |
Location: | United States |
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Hey, it's only a buck, right? Geoff Johns is involved, right? This has to be something good!
In a nutshell, Max Lord ( the manager of the Giffen-DeMatteis JLA with Stephen King-esque "pushing" powers ) is out to get rid of the most powerful metahumans. Apparently, he's had this agenda for years, but we didn't notice.
There are several launchpoints for each of the four new series.
Max tries to recruit Blue Beetle ( since he's not a metahuman ... now Max is a metahuman, but one that "he can trust". )
Max ends up putting a bullet through Beetle's cranium.
Oh, yeah... Luthor, Black Adam, Talia, the Calculator, Deathstroke, and Dr. Psycho (?) are in there. Dr Light's in there too and he's still ticked off about having his mind zapped.
In his address to the readers near the end of the issue, Dan Didio says "let's stop and take a moment for a final goodbye to Ted Kord, Blue Beetle, Adventurer, and Justice Leaguer. He is a favorite of many, and I know he will be missed. And while Ted's story has reached this tragic conclusion, the effects of his death will be felt for months to come and his memory will have a lasting effect on our heroes." Thanks for that, Dan. I feel so much better now. Oh, by the way, I won't be buying any of these four Countdown titles nor any title connected with or affected by Countdown.
Jim
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Fraxon!
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Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 10:27 pm |
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Joined: | 22 Aug 2004 |
Posts: | 40603 |
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Picked it up, flipped to the last page. Saw that my "hunch" was correct. Put the comic back on the rack.
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Linda
IMWAN Admin |
Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:26 pm |
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Helpful Librarian
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Joined: | Day WAN |
Posts: | 197122 |
Location: | IMWAN Towers |
Bannings: | If you're not nice |
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Would y'all ban me if I were to say something unWAN?
_________________
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Fraxon!
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Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:28 pm |
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Joined: | 22 Aug 2004 |
Posts: | 40603 |
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Responding to something that is unWAN in an unWAN manner should be allowable. Let 'er rip, Bat-chick.
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Linda
IMWAN Admin |
Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:35 pm |
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Helpful Librarian
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Joined: | Day WAN |
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Okay ... based on the things that Dan DiDio has said in the past year, the choices he's made of what to publish (and what not to publish, or cancel), and his comments regarding Infinite Crisis, I would say that he is as poor a comic book "power that be" as Joe Quesada is ... perhaps even worse.
(That was the unWAN part.)
I wonder if we've reached a point where this kind of approach ~ killings, cripplings, rapes and so on ~ are the only things left for the companies to use in order to get us interested (morbidly curious?) in reading the umpty-umpth issues of these ancient characters. I can sort of understand that, but it makes me sad anyway.
_________________
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Gator
IMWAN Admin |
Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:36 pm |
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You can call me 'Leo'
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Joined: | 03 Aug 2004 |
Posts: | 7271 |
Location: | Titletown |
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Linda wrote: Would y'all ban me if I were to say something unWAN? Depends. Are you about to say that Countdown and Identity Crisis are the best thing to happen to comics? 
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Kevin
IMWAN Mod |
Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:47 pm |
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Joined: | 08 Aug 2004 |
Posts: | 11850 |
Location: | Georgia |
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Linda wrote: I wonder if we've reached a point where this kind of approach ~ killings, cripplings, rapes and so on ~ are the only things left for the companies to use in order to get us interested (morbidly curious?) in reading the umpty-umpth issues of these ancient characters. I can sort of understand that, but it makes me sad anyway. Me, too. If this is where Didio plans to take the DCU as a whole, I want no part of it, and I'm afraid that the few titles I still get will be dragged into his "vision." And it's also somewhat demoralizing to realize I'm in the minority, at least among DC's readership.
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Gator
IMWAN Admin |
Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:50 pm |
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You can call me 'Leo'
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Joined: | 03 Aug 2004 |
Posts: | 7271 |
Location: | Titletown |
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Kevin wrote: And it's also somewhat demoralizing to realize I'm in the minority, at least among DC's readership. Kevin, if it's any consulation, looking at the latest sales figures you would be in the minority out of only 30,000 or so total comic buyers. Does that make you a minority of a minority?
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Ed Sanders
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Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2005 12:00 am |
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Joined: | 22 Aug 2004 |
Posts: | 5700 |
Location: | Florida |
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Are we going to start calling them D* now?
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John Burgess
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Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2005 12:05 am |
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Joined: | 17 Sep 2004 |
Posts: | 425 |
Location: | St. Louis |
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Gator wrote: out of only 30,000 or so total comic buyers. Whoa, whoa, whoa. Where do you get those numbers from. If I had to take a guess I'ld say there are something more like 500,000 comic buyers out there.
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Jimmy Mnemonic
IMWAN Admin |
Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2005 12:55 am |
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Joined: | 22 Aug 2004 |
Posts: | 1349 |
Location: | United States |
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I guess I'm at a loss as to how to send a message to DC that I did not like this. When fans did so in droves over Identity Crisis, nothing happened ( as evidenced by this book. )
I can quit buying DC books, but I honestly don't think they'll notice.
Jim Lawless
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Gator
IMWAN Admin |
Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2005 7:56 am |
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You can call me 'Leo'
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Joined: | 03 Aug 2004 |
Posts: | 7271 |
Location: | Titletown |
Bannings: | 2 Many 2 Count |
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John Burgess wrote: Whoa, whoa, whoa. Where do you get those numbers from.
Mostly straight out of my head. Though some of the average sales figures I've seen for books these days does look to be in the 30,000 to 50,000 range.
If you factor in that some buyers still get multiple copies of a book, that cuts the larger number down.
Now sure, if we let facts get in the way, then 500,000 is probably more accurate. Since not every fan gets every book published. Those 30,000 or so sales for each book add up.
Of course none of that helps Kevin feel any better about being out of touch with the comic buying community. 
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Jesus Garcia
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Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:22 am |
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Joined: | 30 Aug 2004 |
Posts: | 212 |
Location: | Montreal |
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Heh, Linda beat me to it.
I was going to post that Didio is coming off like an older version of Joe Quesada ... in a suit!
Here's a quote from a recent Newsrama interview:
Quote: NRAMA: Where did the desire for a shift in tonality within the DCU come from?
DD: A lot of this actually came following September 11th. After everything that occurred in New York City, I was coming to work at DC, and going through the Port Authority. At that time, you would walk into the Port Authority, and you would have National Guardsmen standing there with machine guns. He’s standing there holding his machine gun, and is supposed to be making me feel better and more protected, but somehow, that gave me a greater sense of dread – it put me more on edge.
NRAMA: It brings the danger to a visible point…
DD: Absolutely. Honestly, when I looked at that, I felt that was an attitude that we had to bring to our heroes. There should be two reactions when a superhero walks into a room. The first reaction is, “Oh shit, they’re here for something,” and the second reaction is, “Oh shit, I hope they’re not here for me.” No one should be taking a step forward to pat them on the back – they should be taking a step backward, thinking, “Something bad is about to happen here.”
The whole interview can be found here
http://www.newsarama.com/pages/DC/Didio_Countdown.htm
So basically, as long as Didio is in charge, we will be subjected to 'dark' versions of DC superheroes -- the pattern that was already set in Indentity Crisis.
Given what Marvel and DC are doing with their characters these days, I think it's time to stop calling them superheroes ... maybe we should imitate Max Lord and call them 'metas' or imitate Bendis and refer to them as 'powers'.
But certainly not 'heroes'. One more nail in the coffin.
Last edited by Jesus Garcia on Thu Mar 31, 2005 10:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Steven Clubb
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Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:50 am |
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#NeverThor
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Joined: | 01 Mar 2005 |
Posts: | 26316 |
Location: | Dorne |
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Maybe I'm just an old bastard, but I don't much care for comics that seem to be showing off how much Continuity they know. Had this problem with Kevin Smith's Green Arrow, I.D. Crisis, Rebirth, and now this one. I'm just read through these things and think "that's 10 years ago, that's 15 years ago, why are they referencing this stuff?" And it's not just a reference or two, it's non-stop referencing.
Maybe I'm just weird because I want my comic companies to sort of forget all this stuff after a few years. I just can't help but feel it's wrong that I've read reasonably little DCU Comics in the last ten years and I'm catching virtually every reference. Feels like a mixture of nostalgia and carnage... like going to your High School Reunion with a shotgun.
And that's before I even bother to sit and think about all the Continuity they're twisting around. I wonder who will be the next big Revelation. Did Grodd rape and kill Beppo The Super-Monkey with a Kryptonite Condom? The whole thing is getting on the ridiculous side.
_________________ I reserve the right to be spectacularly wrong.
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Rawburn
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Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2005 9:28 am |
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Joined: | 24 Sep 2004 |
Posts: | 13716 |
Location: | ToWANto |
Bannings: | Too ignored to be banned. |
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You know what? I enjoyed this book with two major exceptions.
First, was the last page -- was that really necessary? I'm sure the set up was there that someone (maybe Ted, maybe not) will become a more powerful Blue Beetle a la the original (Dan Garrett). Unfortunately, I like Ted Kord and I liked him as the BB, flying bug and all. This was a major mistake... especially after how well BB was handled in the first 79 pages of this book. Beyond disappointing.
Second, the portrayals of Superman and J'onn J'onzz were way off. Batman was grating, but this seems to be the norm of late. Would the 'real' Supes and JJ treat Beetle like a pain in the ass? I don't think so. They should be patient and warm characters. Right?
Gah! Other than these two major sore points, the book was an okay read and sets up some nice stuff. Unfortunately, like IC, it went too far... and unnecessarily.
_________________ Bigmouth strikes again!
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Rawburn
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Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2005 9:30 am |
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Joined: | 24 Sep 2004 |
Posts: | 13716 |
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Isn't anyone else curious how this Countdown stuff could possibly tie into a sequel to Crisis on Infinite Earths? Seems like two totally different animals to me. Any thoughts?
_________________ Bigmouth strikes again!
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Ed Sanders
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Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2005 9:34 am |
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Joined: | 22 Aug 2004 |
Posts: | 5700 |
Location: | Florida |
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Maybe Oracle is the Monitor in disguise....she does "watch" the heroes.....
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Jesus Garcia
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Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2005 10:37 am |
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Joined: | 30 Aug 2004 |
Posts: | 212 |
Location: | Montreal |
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One of the things that I retained from the Busiek/Perez JLA/Avengers collaboration is the statement that DC universe superheroes are publicly revered whereas Marvel universe superheroes are publicly reviled. At the time I was following the book, I took this plot element to be an amusing reflection on the editorial philosophies that prevailed at DC and Marvel regarding how non-powered human beings would react to super-powered beings, human or otherwise.
It seems that DC is now leaning toward the Marvel philosophy. From now on, when a DC superheroe makes the scene, bystanders will be frightened because they'll figure some disaster is impending ... rather then be thankful for a superheroic presence.
In other words, DC 'superheroes' are now to be perceived as 'supermilitia'.
I don't see how this approach can be considered a follow-up to 1985's Crisis on Infinite Earths. It is far more a follow-up to the Moore/Gibbons Watchmen book which depicted normal humans as afraid of 'masks', and 'masks' as having less than heroic pasts.
With a guy like Didio in charge, Levitz can longer claim the high moral ground in refusing to partner up with Joe Quesada on joint DC/Marvel ventures. Didio is DC's Quesada. He just has less of a potty mouth.
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John Burgess
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Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2005 11:14 am |
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Joined: | 17 Sep 2004 |
Posts: | 425 |
Location: | St. Louis |
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Gator wrote: Of course none of that helps Kevin feel any better about being out of touch with the comic buying community.  But if there are 500,000 comic book buyers out there and IC or Countdown only sell 200,000 or so copies... then the non-buyers are the majority. 8)
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Pip
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Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2005 12:12 pm |
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Joined: | 16 Aug 2004 |
Posts: | 2921 |
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Steven Clubb wrote: Maybe I'm just weird because I want my comic companies to sort of forget all this stuff after a few years.
Amen. No wonder younger readers aren't interested in comics these days. You have to be a historian to get past the first few pages.
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Dan H.
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Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2005 12:29 pm |
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Roll for initiative!
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Joined: | 27 Aug 2004 |
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Location: | Southern Illinois |
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i won't get this book until my order arrives in the second week of April, but i had to look in and get spoiled...not like i didn't know what was going to happen anyway...
nonetheless...*sob*
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Gator
IMWAN Admin |
Post subject: DC's Countdown ( major spoilers ) Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2005 12:51 pm |
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You can call me 'Leo'
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Joined: | 03 Aug 2004 |
Posts: | 7271 |
Location: | Titletown |
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John Burgess wrote: Gator wrote: Of course none of that helps Kevin feel any better about being out of touch with the comic buying community.  But if there are 500,000 comic book buyers out there and IC or Countdown only sell 200,000 or so copies... then the non-buyers are the majority. 8) Now we're cookin'. I just knew I was onto something here. 
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