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 Post subject: Nils Lofgren on Michael Vick
PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 12:08 am 
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From ESPN.com (this was posted by Nils himself-I guess here's another guy who thinks Vick wasn't railroaded!):

An open letter to the men and women of the sports reporting community,

I am so disheartened and disappointed by your collective, lopsided praise of Michael Vick due to his recent spectacular on-field performance.


Jemele Hill stated on ESPN's "The Sports Reporters" that if Josh Hamilton could win one of baseball's MVP awards after recovering from alcohol and drug abuse, why couldn't Vick win the award in the NFL? Well, for one thing, Hamilton has neither tortured dozens of dogs nor murdered defenseless animals.



I do not know what is in Michael Vick's head or heart. But in a recent ESPN interview, and elsewhere, he stated that while he was committing these heinous acts of cruelty, it never occurred to him that he was doing anything wrong.

What a chilling, telling statement.

In Vick's case, I believe his second chance should certainly allow him to be free and to love and raise his family. I think he should make speeches about the error of his ways and help animal groups. I understand that he is doing some of these things and I applaud that. He's also admitted to being haunted by his dogfighting days. That growth is welcome and necessary, but comes too late for me and those dogs.

I support his right to earn a living. But, while I can't fault him for taking great advantage of the opportunities afforded him by playing in the NFL, I feel he does not deserve that lofty a place in our society and culture. However repentant he may be, he committed acts whose vileness will resonate down the years. When you do what Vick did, a second chance should never include the rare gift of an NFL career and the potential bounty it offers.

Shame on the NFL for not banning him permanently.

How can we justify this saga to our children?



The fighting is bad enough. But when the dogs aren't up to their standards of violence, they'll beat the dogs against walls until they're dead, hang, electrocute or drown them.

And if the schedule is too busy for torture that day, they'll just shoot them dead as the poor dogs gaze desperately into their eyes for just one moment of love or kindness. But love is one thing those dogs are forever and viciously denied.

When you do what Vick did, a second chance should never include the rare gift of an NFL career and the potential bounty it offers.

In addition to forcing the dogs to fight, Vick and his cohorts bred the dogs. A butcher is often called in to rip out the teeth and nails of these innocent canines, making it easier to chain them to what is known in fighting circles as a rape stand to be forcibly mated -- cultivating only fear, rage and hate in these blameless creatures. All of that to create more fighting dogs whose lives will just repeat a cycle of unspeakable suffering.



Well kids, although doing those things is wrong, two years after you admit to doing them the NFL will let you have a job that may lead to an MVP award and many millions of dollars in a new contract.

Parents are already dealing with a society seemingly gone mad. We have many troubled kids in our country. Some of them act out by hurting animals, themselves and others in various ways. How do we square our interest in saving children when they can clearly see this kind of evil behavior, for some, is only a big bump on the road to fame, fortune and glory?

Truly frightening.

I am a giant sports fan. However, the cynic in me thinks maybe if Vick were a third-string lineman, the NFL would have set an example and banned him for life. Maybe many of the other significant charges Vick was facing wouldn't have gone away if he didn't have the prestige of being an NFL quarterback who can afford high-priced lawyers to wrangle pleas and deals.

For the NFL to be that forgiving of evil, vicious behavior is a terribly inappropriate act of forgiveness and has brought a sick, sad, dirty feeling to many of us fans who have loved the game for so long.

And to you reporters, whom I enjoy and respect, the sentiments in this letter are suspiciously absent in your hundreds of hours of Vick coverage.

Recently, on another edition of "The Sports Reporters," Mike Lupica said that this Vick issue spoke to the shallowness of the pro sports world.

Wow! Three seconds versus hundreds of "Vick's so great!" hours. Way to go! Just because the NFL lost its spine and common sense on this matter doesn't mean you reporters have to get in line and go along.

Sincerely,

Nils Lofgren
Musician and huge sports fan, hurt and demoralized



Nils Lofgren is a virtuoso rock guitarist who has toured with Bruce Springsteen and the E Street Band, Ringo Starr, Neil Young and others. He has also released more than 40 solo albums.

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 Post subject: Nils Lofgren on Michael Vick
PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 12:38 am 
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Good for Nils!

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 Post subject: Nils Lofgren on Michael Vick
PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 2:11 am 
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Marcus wrote:
Good for Nils!

:thumbsup:

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 Post subject: Nils Lofgren on Michael Vick
PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 5:44 am 
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Did Michael Vick pay his due to society or did he not? We have courts, the jury system and a judge to hand down sentencing for a reason in this country. There is an excellent cover story about Michael Vick from SI 2 weeks ago if anybody in here is open-minded enough to read it. You keep dredging Vick up, IP, so I'll keep commenting on it. I find it amusing that I am being painted as a Vick apologist, hell, even a Vick fan, when I am neither. Lofgren says he has no problem with Vick earning a living and feeding his family, he just shouldn't be able to work in the NFL. How hypocritical is that? Where should he work Nils? Should we have a panel decide that as well? If Vick had just gotten a fine or maybe a month in jail, I'd be right there with you all. But 19 months hard time and 2 months house confinement, bankruptcy and a large chunk of his game checks going to his creditors--he paid the price for doing what he did. All of you meat eaters in here, the dead animal on your plate wasn't treated any better than Michael Vick's dogs, but I guess as long as you don't see it, it's ok. Animals are being abused in laboratories RIGHT NOW in this country but I could go through 99.9% of the medicine cabinets of anybody on here and find plenty of products that were tested on those animals when they didn't need to be. Anybody in here go to the greyhound races? Save for the few that get adopted, guess what happens to those dogs when they stop running well? I have no issues with anybody thinking what Vick did was disgusting. I can also guarantee you that Vick was also raised that way. All Vick can do is serve whatever sentence he was given, is he supposed to ask the judge for more time? He can only put it behind him and move on with his life. When Vick sucked prior to this year, how many people cared? Now that he's doing well, that's just not right. If Vick can't win the MVP, then let's screen all potential candidates for any off the field transgressions. Once he was allowed back into the league, he's eligible for any award out there.If I had to have someone over to my home, I'd have Michael Vick any day before I had somebody who hunts. Oh yeah, THAT killing of defenseless animals is fine, it's not against the law--MY BAD.


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 Post subject: Nils Lofgren on Michael Vick
PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 9:51 am 
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James Dean wrote:
Lofgren says he has no problem with Vick earning a living and feeding his family, he just shouldn't be able to work in the NFL. How hypocritical is that? Where should he work Nils?

Wal-Mart's always hiring.


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 Post subject: Nils Lofgren on Michael Vick
PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 10:05 am 
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Who are those guys?

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I really understand where Nils is coming from, and I completely respect his position. But I'm on the fence. I guess I believe in forgiveness, and giving people a second chance. As long as Vick seems remorseful, and actively supports animal rights causes, I think he should be allowed to play. The increased visibility he has now that he's resurrected his career gives him a greater opportunity to make amends. I think he knows he made a mistake.

I am no Michael Vick fan, and I wouldn't have felt bad if he had been banned from the NFL. But I think everyone deserves a second chance and an opportunity to atone for their transgressions. That's the path that holds the best chance for the best possible outcome -- for everyone .


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 Post subject: Nils Lofgren on Michael Vick
PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 11:24 am 
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Joined: 26 Sep 2006
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James Dean wrote:
Did Michael Vick pay his due to society or did he not? We have courts, the jury system and a judge to hand down sentencing for a reason in this country. There is an excellent cover story about Michael Vick from SI 2 weeks ago if anybody in here is open-minded enough to read it. You keep dredging Vick up, IP, so I'll keep commenting on it. I find it amusing that I am being painted as a Vick apologist, hell, even a Vick fan, when I am neither. Lofgren says he has no problem with Vick earning a living and feeding his family, he just shouldn't be able to work in the NFL. How hypocritical is that? Where should he work Nils? Should we have a panel decide that as well? If Vick had just gotten a fine or maybe a month in jail, I'd be right there with you all. But 19 months hard time and 2 months house confinement, bankruptcy and a large chunk of his game checks going to his creditors--he paid the price for doing what he did. All of you meat eaters in here, the dead animal on your plate wasn't treated any better than Michael Vick's dogs, but I guess as long as you don't see it, it's ok. Animals are being abused in laboratories RIGHT NOW in this country but I could go through 99.9% of the medicine cabinets of anybody on here and find plenty of products that were tested on those animals when they didn't need to be. Anybody in here go to the greyhound races? Save for the few that get adopted, guess what happens to those dogs when they stop running well? I have no issues with anybody thinking what Vick did was disgusting. I can also guarantee you that Vick was also raised that way. All Vick can do is serve whatever sentence he was given, is he supposed to ask the judge for more time? He can only put it behind him and move on with his life. When Vick sucked prior to this year, how many people cared? Now that he's doing well, that's just not right. If Vick can't win the MVP, then let's screen all potential candidates for any off the field transgressions. Once he was allowed back into the league, he's eligible for any award out there.If I had to have someone over to my home, I'd have Michael Vick any day before I had somebody who hunts. Oh yeah, THAT killing of defenseless animals is fine, it's not against the law--MY BAD.

I look at VIck's case the same way I look at Kobe Bryant's--I'm just not moved when athletes who are shitty human beings.subsequently do well out on the playing field.


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 Post subject: Nils Lofgren on Michael Vick
PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 11:44 am 
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As long as he's active in the fight against dog fighting, I don't mind him being in the NFL. His celebrity now helps that cause. An MVP trophy would only help it more. The day that he stops touring and giving talks in defense of those dogs, he needs to exit the NFL. He did his time and paid his dues, but he has a greater opportunity than most criminals when it comes to making amends. Great power, great responsibility, yaddah yaddah... His good fortune should now be tied directly to making up for his errors.


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 Post subject: Nils Lofgren on Michael Vick
PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 12:00 pm 
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As a lifelong dog owner I think Michael Vick is a disgusting, reprehensible, waste-of-human-space. BUT, he was caught, tried & convicted and he served his time. He won't ever be welcomed into Casa del Fraxon, but he's done his bit and should be allowed to get on with his life. The NFL are also free to run their business however they see fit. I would have banned him for life, but I don't run the NFL, so if they want to give him a job and pay him millions of dollars, more power to 'em. What I object to (and I think part of what Mr. Lofgren was getting at above) is the sports press acting as though Vick is some sort of "hero" for "overcoming adversity". He's not. He's a brutal, viscious thug who willingly broke the law and got caught.


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 Post subject: Nils Lofgren on Michael Vick
PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 12:09 pm 
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Fraxon! wrote:
As a lifelong dog owner I think Michael Vick is a disgusting, reprehensible, waste-of-human-space. BUT, he was caught, tried & convicted and he served his time. He won't ever be welcomed into Casa del Fraxon, but he's done his bit and should be allowed to get on with his life. The NFL are also free to run their business however they see fit. I would have banned him for life, but I don't run the NFL, so if they want to give him a job and pay him millions of dollars, more power to 'em. What I object to (and I think part of what Mr. Lofgren was getting at above) is the sports press acting as though Vick is some sort of "hero" for "overcoming adversity". He's not. He's a brutal, viscious thug who willingly broke the law and got caught.

This. This a lot.


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 Post subject: Nils Lofgren on Michael Vick
PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 12:16 pm 
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Fraxon! wrote:
As a lifelong dog owner I think Michael Vick is a disgusting, reprehensible, waste-of-human-space. BUT, he was caught, tried & convicted and he served his time. He won't ever be welcomed into Casa del Fraxon, but he's done his bit and should be allowed to get on with his life. The NFL are also free to run their business however they see fit. I would have banned him for life, but I don't run the NFL, so if they want to give him a job and pay him millions of dollars, more power to 'em. What I object to (and I think part of what Mr. Lofgren was getting at above) is the sports press acting as though Vick is some sort of "hero" for "overcoming adversity". He's not. He's a brutal, viscious thug who willingly broke the law and got caught.


Yep, that's pretty much it.

If they'd stop mentioning that shit, I wouldn't mind it all so much. I mean, I'd still dislike the guy, but I wouldn't be as pissed if sports reporters would stop acting like this guy is Rocky Balboa come to life.


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 Post subject: Nils Lofgren on Michael Vick
PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 1:29 pm 
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Typical press...beat them down and then resurrect them. For the press, that's job security, always having something to report on while the celebrities are on the way down and then on the way back up.

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 Post subject: Nils Lofgren on Michael Vick
PostPosted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 2:49 pm 
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I agree with a lot what Nils says, but not all of it. Vick has paid his dues even though what he was knowingly involved in for years was a sickening, disgusting act.
Being an Eagles fan this has been a real challenge all over the city. There are numerous articles about what parents should do about buying their kids Vick jerseys for Christmas-it's not an easy call.
I love animals more than people, so I still have mixed feelings when I have to root for Vick. I can only hope he has done what he needs to do and will never be involved with that garbage again.
Lofgren states Vick should work but just not in the NFL, yet I ask what about musicians who have done despicable things? Should they still be playing? Tommy Lee, Gary Glitter, Jerry Lee Lewis, Rick Allen (a one armed drummer who beat his wife) and so on.
I think he makes some contradictory statements, but I do applaud his stance on this issue. What Vick did should never be forgotten and I doubt it will. But the human being in me really does hope he's turned his life around.
P.S.
Lofgren is a Giants season ticket holder and Vick is on the Eagles and having a Pro Bowl season. Hmmmmmm.....

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