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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 3:10 pm 
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Jason Czeskleba wrote:
You are inverting my point. I was saying that IF one argues the disc one recreation/vinyl release of Smile should be all mono because that was Brian's original intention, then one could just as easily argue that only 45-50 minutes should have been released because that was also Brian's original intention. I disagree with both points. I am glad they released several discs, and I wish they had released the main material (disc one) in stereo, even though both of those things run counter to Brian's original intent.


I inverted your point, because you didn't have one, really. Again, I bring to your attention that the box is called the Smile Sessions. Therefore, anything recorded during those sessions is fair game for release. You talk as if the object was to recreate the Smile album, making it only 45-50 minutes long. That was never the intention of the box as a whole. So you had no point to begin with.

Look, if you want it in stereo, I don't know what to tell you. Maybe one day the powers that be will convince Brian to let stereo mixes be released. Hell, they did it with Pet Sounds so you never know...


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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 3:51 pm 
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Matt Wilson wrote:
I inverted your point, because you didn't have one, really. Again, I bring to your attention that the box is called the Smile Sessions. Therefore, anything recorded during those sessions is fair game for release. You talk as if the object was to recreate the Smile album, making it only 45-50 minutes long. That was never the intention of the box as a whole. So you had no point to begin with.


Ah, the internet, where it's never enough to say "I disagree with your point." It has to be "You have no point." I guess now I'm now supposed to accuse you of being too stupid to see my point? Yawn. I'll skip that.

Anyway, what is the rationale for mixing the main tracks (ie, disc one and the vinyl release) into mono? According to those in charge it's because that was the way it would have been done if the album had been released in 1967. Since the album is (as you point out) "The Smile Sessions" rather than an attempt to recreate the Smile album, why should they limit the sound in this way? To me, limiting the sound to mono is analogous to limiting the tracklist to 45 minutes. Both are unnecessary for a release of this sort, since as you say, it's not really an attempt to create an accurate version of the album as it would have been released in 1967.

I imagine you don't consider mono to be a sonic limitation. Fine. That's where we disagree. I suspect a majority of listeners would prefer this release to be in stereo, however. Especially given the fact the mono mixes here are not vintage Wilson mixes, so they have no more historical accuracy than new stereo mixes would.


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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 4:40 pm 
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The "majority" of listeners? No, I'd say the majority of listerners agree with the decision to release the Smile Sessions in mono.


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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 6:01 pm 
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Is this the new version of Phil vs. Andrew?? :sigh:


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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 6:02 pm 
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Matt Wilson wrote:
The "majority" of listeners? No, I'd say the majority of listerners agree with the decision to release the Smile Sessions in mono.


Not really sure what you're basing that statement on, unless you've spoken with a "majority" of listeners.

As for myself, I listen to life in stereo. Why, then, would I prefer my music in mono?


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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 6:15 pm 
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Jay wrote:
Chris,

No single disc was released domestically. Very irritating, and I say this as someone who bought the box set and the 2-CD version.


Thanks, Jay. I'm not a huge BB fan. My BB collection consists of a two disc Greatest Hits, Pet Sounds, a Smile bootleg and now, the official version as well.

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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 6:20 pm 
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Roxanne Marciniak wrote:
Is this the new version of Phil vs. Andrew?? :sigh:

Funny, I was thinking the EXACT same thing! Why can't we all just enjoy the music? I know I am!! :party:

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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 6:31 pm 
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banzaibid wrote:
Roxanne Marciniak wrote:
Is this the new version of Phil vs. Andrew?? :sigh:

Funny, I was thinking the EXACT same thing! Why can't we all just enjoy the music? I know I am!! :party:

Wouldn't it be nice...


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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 6:38 pm 
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Schads wrote:
Matt Wilson wrote:
The "majority" of listeners? No, I'd say the majority of listerners agree with the decision to release the Smile Sessions in mono.

Not really sure what you're basing that statement on, unless you've spoken with a "majority" of listeners.

As for myself, I listen to life in stereo. Why, then, would I prefer my music in mono?

Unless one is hearing-impaired (which Brian Wilson is), we listen to life in surround.

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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 8:33 pm 
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Linda wrote:
Schads wrote:
Matt Wilson wrote:
The "majority" of listeners? No, I'd say the majority of listerners agree with the decision to release the Smile Sessions in mono.

Not really sure what you're basing that statement on, unless you've spoken with a "majority" of listeners.

As for myself, I listen to life in stereo. Why, then, would I prefer my music in mono?

Unless one is hearing-impaired (which Brian Wilson is), we listen to life in surround.


We see life in color too, I guess there should be no such thing as black and white movies.

Hey, I already said maybe we'll get a stereo Smile one day, what else do ya want?

And the majority of people on amazon who are reviewing the Smile Sessions box are happy with it in mono, as are the majority of people on the Hoffman site and anywhere else you read reviews.


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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 8:59 pm 
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Matt Wilson wrote:
Linda wrote:
Schads wrote:
Matt Wilson wrote:
The "majority" of listeners? No, I'd say the majority of listerners agree with the decision to release the Smile Sessions in mono.

Not really sure what you're basing that statement on, unless you've spoken with a "majority" of listeners.

As for myself, I listen to life in stereo. Why, then, would I prefer my music in mono?

Unless one is hearing-impaired (which Brian Wilson is), we listen to life in surround.

We see life in color too, I guess there should be no such thing as black and white movies.

Hey, I already said maybe we'll get a stereo Smile one day, what else do ya want?

I wanted a mono mix first and foremost (in case that wasn't clear from my posts). Stereo mixes of pre-1969 recordings don't interest me. A surround mix would interest me a lot, though. :)

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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 9:16 pm 
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Linda wrote:
I wanted a mono mix first and foremost (in case that wasn't clear from my posts). Stereo mixes of pre-1969 recordings don't interest me. A surround mix would interest me a lot, though. :)


I actually like to have both the mono and stereo versions of most Beatle-era rock, that way I can choose which one I like best. For the pre-Beatles rock 'n' roll era, then I like strictly mono, unless it was only recorded in stereo. For Beach Boys or Spector stuff though, then you have to honor the original intentions of the producers.

It would've been disingenuous for a 2011 Smile box of '66/'67 recordings to have been released in stereo. The minority of fans who are carping about it being in mono is nothing compared to those of us who would've boycotted the set had it been in stereo, and Capital knows this - otherwise, you can bet they'd have mixed it to stereo.


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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 9:29 pm 
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banzaibid wrote:
Roxanne Marciniak wrote:
Is this the new version of Phil vs. Andrew?? :sigh:

Funny, I was thinking the EXACT same thing! Why can't we all just enjoy the music? I know I am!! :party:


I am too. I hope that doesn't preclude all discussion of things we wish might have been different about the set though. Is this thread so traumatized by the Phil/Andrew thing it can't tolerate any differing opinions? I hope not.

Matt, no disrespect, but I'm skeptical you or anyone else would truly have boycotted this set if disc one had been comprised of stereo mixes rather than mono. Seriously, you're saying you'd deprive yourself of this music over that? I mean, I wish it was stereo, but I'll gladly take mono over nothing in this case and I bet all my fellow stereo-lovers feel the same.


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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 9:33 pm 
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If you're in the "still on the fence" camp about this release, do check out our three-part series on THE SMiLE SESSIONS at The Second Disc; we've endeavored to examine this release from every possible angle! Here's a link to the concluding part, which contains links back to Parts I & II:

http://theseconddisc.com/2011/11/02/rev ... eat-shape/

All best,

Joe


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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2011 9:41 pm 
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Jason Czeskleba wrote:
Matt, no disrespect, but I'm skeptical you or anyone else would truly have boycotted this set if disc one had been comprised of stereo mixes rather than mono. Seriously, you're saying you'd deprive yourself of this music over that? I mean, I wish it was stereo, but I'll gladly take mono over nothing in this case and I bet all my fellow stereo-lovers feel the same.


I dunno, It would've pissed me off though. I may not have bought it, who knows? It sounded good, so I said it.

And for the record, I don't prefer everything pre '69 or whatever in mono. Hendrix and the Doors, for instance, sound better in stereo to me. The Bee Gees makes no difference. I like Highway 61 Revisited better in stereo, etc.

I think it was the '09 mono Beatles box which swayed me.


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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2011 12:25 am 
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JMarch3035 wrote:
If you're in the "still on the fence" camp about this release, do check out our three-part series on THE SMiLE SESSIONS at The Second Disc; we've endeavored to examine this release from every possible angle! Here's a link to the concluding part, which contains links back to Parts I & II:

http://theseconddisc.com/2011/11/02/rev ... eat-shape/

All best,

Joe

Joe,

Fantastic read! Thanks so much for sharing. Really appreciate the detailed comparison to BWPS. The box is truly a gift for those of us who are SMiLE fans.

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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2011 11:10 am 
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Matt Wilson wrote:
Linda wrote:
Schads wrote:
Matt Wilson wrote:
The "majority" of listeners? No, I'd say the majority of listerners agree with the decision to release the Smile Sessions in mono.

Not really sure what you're basing that statement on, unless you've spoken with a "majority" of listeners.

As for myself, I listen to life in stereo. Why, then, would I prefer my music in mono?

Unless one is hearing-impaired (which Brian Wilson is), we listen to life in surround.


We see life in color too, I guess there should be no such thing as black and white movies.



Agreed. And that's why I watch 3D movies exclusively....... :ohyes:


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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2011 11:48 am 
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Linda wrote:
Stereo mixes of pre-1969 recordings don't interest me.


The more I hear, the more I'm coming to this conclusion, generally speaking.


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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2011 1:12 pm 
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Dean Harris wrote:
Linda wrote:
Stereo mixes of pre-1969 recordings don't interest me.


The more I hear, the more I'm coming to this conclusion, generally speaking.


Pretty much. Some things definitely sound better in mono to me: Piper at the Gates of Dawn or the first Buffalo Springfield album. Others are still better in stereo though, like Surrealistic Pillow.

It's not black and white.


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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2011 1:17 pm 
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Matt Wilson wrote:

Pretty much. Some things definitely sound better in mono to me: Piper at the Gates of Dawn or the first Buffalo Springfield album. Others are still better in stereo though, like Surrealistic Pillow.

It's not black and white.


Comparing the mono/stereo After Bathing at Baxter's was the real eye-opener for me. While I prefer the stereo of this one, the mono is a terrific and altogether different experience. I have the gold disc Surrealistic Pillow filed away somewhere and have never listened to the mono. Must find it (once I find which box I packed it in before I moved).


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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2011 1:20 pm 
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Dean Harris wrote:
Matt Wilson wrote:

Pretty much. Some things definitely sound better in mono to me: Piper at the Gates of Dawn or the first Buffalo Springfield album. Others are still better in stereo though, like Surrealistic Pillow.

It's not black and white.


Comparing the mono/stereo After Bathing at Baxter's was the real eye-opener for me. While I prefer the stereo of this one, the mono is a terrific and altogether different experience. I have the gold disc Surrealistic Pillow filed away somewhere and have never listened to the mono. Must find it (once I find which box I packed it in before I moved).


As an Airplane fanatic, I would love to hear the mono Baxters, but as yet...

And I've got that Atlantic gold disc of Pillow too, that's how I have the mono version.


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 Post subject: [2011-11-01] The Beach Boys "The SMiLE Sessions" (Capitol/EMI)
PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2011 1:23 pm 
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Looks like Czeskleba is trying to drum up support for his stereo Smile idea on the Hoffman forum:

http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showt ... p?t=267725


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