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 Post subject: Some Crits for Hugh - Mary Marvel
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 3:37 am 
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Here's a piece coloured by Hugh Cherry, drawn by Cully Hamner. I really like what Hugh did with the colouring, and I thought I'd offer my two cents on how the image could be 'punched up' as well :)

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I like the painting style - this is generally referred to as 'cut film'. Aside from the background, there is no airbrush or gradient modeling - instead it is all blocks of solid colour, just as older American (and most Manga) funnybooks were done.

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 Post subject: Some Crits for Hugh - Mary Marvel
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 3:44 am 
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I'd like to discuss the modeling here, and how to approach it.

Now, the best way to start figuring out how to do the modeling on a figure like this is to look at certain key shadows that the artist has created - usually under the nose. In this case, we'll look at the shadows under the chin and her skirt.

These shadows indicate that the primary light source on the figure should be in front of the figure, up and to the left (the viewer's left - I'll keep referring left/right instructions from the perspective of the viewer). Thus, as the arrow I've drawn indicates, the light falls on the figure from that general area.

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 Post subject: Some Crits for Hugh - Mary Marvel
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 3:47 am 
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Now, where this works very well are in the circled areas here - Hugh really nails it on Mary's face and circled leg.

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 Post subject: Some Crits for Hugh - Mary Marvel
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 3:52 am 
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However, there are two parts where the modeling isn't working quite as well. The parts circled here have contradictory lighting - the lighting appears to be coming the right. Now, this undercuts the three-dimensional feel that consistant lighting can create.

In these cases, the shadow (darker) colour should really be on the right side of the limbs/torso rather than how it is set up.

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 Post subject: Some Crits for Hugh - Mary Marvel
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 3:56 am 
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To add to this effect, it would work really well to add a shadow on the cape as indicated here - a shadow cast by Mary's arm and torso, with perhaps even a small shadow cast by her hair as well.

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 Post subject: Some Crits for Hugh - Mary Marvel
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 4:06 am 
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Here, I've tinkered with the modeling a little bit, to better show what I've been discussing. Note that I'm not adding to the modeling, or changing the style, just moving the light source around on a few places. This way you can better judge the techniques that I'm talking about.

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 Post subject: Some Crits for Hugh - Mary Marvel
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 4:14 am 
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Here's one final change, where the lightning blast now goes to blue instead of yellow. I did this to better separate Mary (who is composed of warm colours) from the background (changing the lightning to a cool colour). True, often the lightning involved for the whole Marvel family tends to be yellow/orange instead of blue, but for the purposes of this particular image, Mary pops away from the background a bit more effectively with the blue energy.

A decision like this will be 50% colour theory and 50% story reasons - if it better serves the story that the lightning not be blue, then making it more of a white colour would still be more effective than going to yellow - that way, it still looks as though it is behind her more than part of her.

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 Post subject: Some Crits for Hugh - Mary Marvel
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 4:19 am 
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That's about it. Like I said, what Hugh was doing with this picture was really solid, with perhaps just a few tweaks to really bring it out. His basic colour scheme and colouring approach really works well with this very cool piece of artwork!

One of the things that I really liked about the colouring was the fact that Hugh was using only one light source - another one easily could have been added, but the simplicity of a single light source can be very striking. The only problem with sticking to a single light source is that the colourist has to then be consistant to just that one source all the way through the figure.

Please, anyone and everyone can and should feel free to ask any questions, challenge any statements I've made here, and so on :)

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 Post subject: Some Crits for Hugh - Mary Marvel
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 11:23 am 
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I CHALLENGE YOUR STATEMENTS!!!

Just kidding. Great tutorial again, Ian.

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 Post subject: Some Crits for Hugh - Mary Marvel
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 11:38 am 
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Niatpac Levram!!!!!!

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Thanks Ian!

HAH!

I was going to go with a blue for the lightning originally, for the exact same reason you mentioned, but my wife said "Blue Lightning???!? It's always yellow in the comics!"

Agreed about the shadow under her left arm. I felt it was too.........blank, but didn't really know what would look best.

Here's a question.
How would you approach this if the only source of light was the lightning? (or for a little more detail a more subtle source from the front also?)

Or for that matter how would you go after this picture?
I have an idea myself, and will work on it some today, and see if We are on the same wavelength.

Image


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 Post subject: Some Crits for Hugh - Mary Marvel
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 12:57 pm 
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Niatpac Levram!!!!!!

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Here's an updated version per Ian's recommendations.

I used a slightly different blue for the lightning highlights, and added a few tiny modificatioins of my own.

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 Post subject: Some Crits for Hugh - Mary Marvel
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:25 pm 
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Looking good, Hugh!

I would like to mention one thing that you've still got in this version, something I removed but forgot to say that I've removed - this highlight on the skirt.

You've got a shadow behind the lines on the skirt - this indicates that the light is still coming from the left and front, just like on the rest of the figure.

However, you've also got a highlight on the other side of the lines. This looks more like you've got a second light source coming from the right. If you get rid of that highlight, then you go back to the consistency of the single light source. :)

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 Post subject: Some Crits for Hugh - Mary Marvel
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:42 pm 
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Hugh wrote:
Here's a question.
How would you approach this if the only source of light was the lightning? (or for a little more detail a more subtle source from the front also?)

Or for that matter how would you go after this picture?
I have an idea myself, and will work on it some today, and see if We are on the same wavelength.

Image

Here's a very rough example of how I would approach the colouring on this picture. Basically, I'm keeping the background surrounding Mary much lighter than her, actually going all the way to white. Oh, I'd do some more complex painting in the cloudy parts further away from her, moreso than I've depicted here, but this is just a rough version.

Her colouring is extremely simple - basically just a grad from yellow to red (or yellow to orange on the yellow parts of her costume). I'd keep this consistant throughout the rest of the figure.

Now, the parts of her that aren't directly facing the explosion (like the 'interior' of the cape behind her head, or the inside of her skirt) are much, much darker, showing that the light really doesn't get to that spot.

I've also got the white cape going lighter than her reds. The yellow parts do as well, because quite often (especially in the Alex Ross versions) those are depicted as being a shinier material than the rest of her costume (more like silk than spandex).

So, this is my basic approach to this figure. Oh, and I'd also finish the arms and legs ;)

Image

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 Post subject: Some Crits for Hugh - Mary Marvel
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:37 pm 
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Cool!
I was thinking the same thing, going from a very dark color to a lighter color around the edges.
You gave some advice to someone recently, about starting with the darkest color you are going to use, and then working toward the lighter colors. Thats what I did with this. I started with the deep interior colors, and gradually moved toward the brights for the edges.

Here's what I have so far. I need to finish her hair, cape trim, and I was going to go with some darker grays in the "interior" of the cape.
A couple of questions,

-The background color........I went with the blue, to offset the reds and yellows, does it work in this case? I also tried a yellow background. Which do you think would work best?

-The cloud next to her right foot......Opinion? Is that the way to go with the rest of them, or do you have any suggestions?

-The airbrush around the chest emblem......neato, or really hokey?

Thanks for the imput!

Image

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 Post subject: Some Crits for Hugh - Mary Marvel
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 3:06 pm 
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Hugh wrote:
-The background color........I went with the blue, to offset the reds and yellows, does it work in this case? I also tried a yellow background. Which do you think would work best?

It really depends on the effect you want - if you go with blue/purple, that pulls her forward away from the explosion (which is good); if you go with yellow/orange, she becomes immersed in the explosion (which is also good). It depends on the type of story idea you are playing with - every picture is a story, and the colours help tell that story.

Really, as long as there is some definition between her edges and the explosion itself (a white glow or something in the explosion), either works well.

Quote:
-The cloud next to her right foot......Opinion? Is that the way to go with the rest of them, or do you have any suggestions?

You're doing fine with that - if it's comfortable with you, then keep at it :D

Quote:
-The airbrush around the chest emblem......neato, or really hokey?

Well, it looks like you are trying to make the chest emblem glow (the same as with the lightning in the previous picture). I'd go with a more saturated yellow colour, not quite as light as you've got.

In general, making an element like that glow can be really tricky. The most important thing about all glows is that the centre should be lighter than the outside of the glow. That is, the glow surrounding the emblem could be a light yellow as long as the emblem itself is white.

I've attached an example here of a glowing chest emblem to kinda illustrate this idea - if the centre is darker than the outside of the glow, it looks like there is a glowing ring around the middle, rather than the glow coming from the middle :)

Image

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 Post subject: Some Crits for Hugh - Mary Marvel
PostPosted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 10:46 pm 
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Wow - a very informative thread here. And a very professional overview (not just in content but approach). Well done Ian and well done Hugh with your original version and openness to taking constructive feedback.

Glad I have enough free time to explore the Drawing Board and even the Writers' Block today!


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